Hope this is the right forum for these questions, otherwise feel free to point me in the right direction.
We’re a small startup that is developing a new type of cutting tool for cutting in rock and concrete (more info here https://www.rockslice.no/).
We have until now relied on third parties for CNC machining, but we see that this is creating a time constraint and prevents us from rapid prototyping.
So we are looking to build up our own machining capabilities. Our product is a bit complicated to machine, so we think a 4 axis setup would be best. We have a 200 square meter workshop with about 120 ampere of available power @ 230 volt.
The 1500 MX CNC Mill with a 4th axis add-on looks like a good choice. But there are a lot of other configuration options, tools and adapters in the configurator. So I’m wondering if there are some recommended packages if you are starting from scratch?
As for software, Fusion 360 is our main goto for CAD - it looks like it would work pretty seamlessly with the Tormach machines. Are there any additional software packages on would need?
What delivery times can we expect and what are the shipping costs? We are based in Norway.
Also, since we are a startup we have limited funding, so does Tormach perhaps have some discounts programs for startups?
Expect to spend about $20,000 on tooling in addition to the machine. That’s vices, work holding, tool holders, end mills, metrology equipment, etc.
Electrics; a 40 amp single phase outlet should be fine.
As far as the package, you’re going to want the everything package. Maybe not the chip conveyor but pretty much everything else. I’m assuming you will be cutting tool steel and deep boring or drilling so you will need through spindle coolant for that. Plus some expensive drill bits. Drilling anything but mild steel without through spindle coolant can be done but it’s brutal and turns expensive carbide drills into carbide hole plugs.
Power: The machine requires 30amp service @ 230v, so you’re fine there.
Fusion: Unless you need true simultaneous 4axis tool paths, there is no need or benefit to the manufacturing extension. The standard paid license for fusion provides quite a lot of multi-axis capability. For all the multi-axis work I’ve done, only one two projects have required anything more than 3+1/3+2 or toolpath wrapping. Without knowing the details of your product, I suspect you will be just fine without the extension.
Machine setup: You mention your part is complex which suggests multiple tools will be needed to produce it so an ATC should be high on your list. I prefer flood coolant over MQL for better chip evacuation and because even a Fogbuster will create quite a lot of coolant mist in your shop (bad for the lungs). No need for the washdown option unless you’re removing a LOT of material, just hose down the inside of the machine at the end of the day. I also probably wouldn’t bother with the chip conveyor unless, as before, you’re planning to do a lot of material removal. Through spindle coolant is a killer feature but entirely unecessary unless you’re doing deep pockets/drilling. A mist collector is a nice thing to have but also not a critical thing (unless you go with MQL then definitely get it). Probe and ETS are not strictly necessary but will make life much easier and will likely reduce scrap parts and allow some level of lights out operation. The camera is largely pointless IMO but it’s so cheap, it doesn’t hurt anything to add it.
Tooling and workholding: No need to spend anywhere near 20k, at least not up front, unless you have a need for really specialized metrology. I imagine you probably already have some of the measuring equipment needed so you can inspect the parts coming in from your existing suppliers. As far as metrology for the machine itself, dial indicator with magnetic base and flexible arm, machinist squares, 1-2-3 blocks, and a precision ground bar (.5-.75") is about all I ever use on a regular basis. A decent vise, t-slot clamp kit, a dozen or so tool holders (I prefer set screw style over ER collets but to each their own), and whatever workholding you need for your 4th axis will get you a long way. You will collect more tool and workholding over time as your needs evolve but there’s no need to go crazy up front. Get the basic stuff and figure out what else you need from there.
Cost: To my knowledge, Tormach does not offer any discounts for startups. They do run promotions from time to time but those are usually limited to free accessories and addons rather than any substantial discount on the machines themselves. Geneva Capital provides financing options (in the states, not sure about Norway) but I’ve never personally worked with them. My suggestion would be to research machine tool financing in your area and contact a lender there is cash is a bit tight.
@Jesper_Tveit welcome to the Forums! I can help with some of these questions, here, and will email you on the side to discuss specific costs and delivery times since that will differ for most people looking at this post.
First I would like to point out that we build our machines to be modular in that you can add accessories as you need them. Granted, the cost and time of getting accessories to Norway might be annoying. Nonetheless, you can add the tool changer, 4th axis, TSC, and other accessories at any time. Here is a brief introduction into the accessories and where you might need them.
Automatic Tool Changer: very handy when you want to make parts while working on other tasks. The machine will automatically swap tools and keep making parts. Some folks forgo the ATC when on a budget or working on jobs that don’t require a lot of tool changes.
4th Axis: great addition to work holding that can hold parts stationary or work in tandem with the table while machining. These are commonly referred to as indexed and synchronized machining.
Through Spindle Coolant: Great for drilling holes quickly, better coolant flow and for chip evacuation.
Chip management:
Chip Conveyor works great for batch produciton runs when you need to keep chips clearing into a hopper
Washdown Bars work to flush the chips out of the enclosure and into the chip pans. This pairs well with the chip conveyor
Probing and tool setting will decrease your setup time and offer you in process probing for feature checking or tool breakage detection.
When purchasing a machine there are a few areas to think about for extras that you will likely need and I will offer a brief summary here:
Tool Holding: The general rule with tool holders is similar to bicycles and guitars; the amount you need is the amount you currently own + 1. The 1500MX has some pre-built tool holding packages and I would start with the Deluxe BT30 Toolholding Set (Metric) and think about adding the Starter BT30 Toolholding Set (Metric) if you want to pad out your options.
Work Holding: Generally speaking, I recomend starting with a CNC vice and toe clamp set. However, if you are going to be doing work on fixtures, larger parts, or lots of different type parts then the SMW Tool Plate makes a great addition to your machine.
a set of parallels are a great all around option for billet work in a vise.
soft jaws come in real handy when working on non square geometry.
Tooling: The world is your oyster when it comes to tooling but we have a few pre-built tooling packages to get you started. These kits are meant to have a little variety to give you some options.
This response got longer than I originally planed but I wanted to give you as much info as possible. Feel free to ask my questions here or at Presales@tormach.com